The rise of C-Sections and its risks. (Information on C-Sections)

[Jessica]

Jennifer Block is the author's name:

 

Amazon.com: Pushed: The Painful Truth About Childbirth and Modern Maternity Care: Jennifer Block: Books

[starchild]

Thanks for sharing Calia and best of luck to you while TTC.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by JessicaLovesBrian I'm not anti c-section, but I personally would not opt to have a c-section unless it was neccessary. I won't go into my reasons, because I think it would be offensive to some of the girls who have chosen to go that route.

Ditto and ditto...

[Sarah]

OK, I could write a short novel here... as a Labor & Delivery nurse, I too am alarmed at the rising number of c-sections. But, I can tell you that there is sooooooo much more to the story than is evident in these articles. They are definitely written in an anti-c/s point of view.

 

The rising percentage of c/s in the US is a result of many factors, and I will be the first to agree that physician convenience is occasionally a contributor. However, this is LARGELY the exception, not the rule. In my 3 years as a L&D nurse, I can think of THREE c/s that I attended and thought they were for a BS reason.

 

Regardless of whether it is right or not, fear of litigation is a ruling factor in ALL American medicine, and obstetrics holds the highest rate of litigation- for obvious reasons. Here's the thing (and probably a novel concept for non-medical personnell): PATIENTS are to blame for this, NOT the medical professionals. Doctors and nurses are only responding to the enviroment in which we've been forced to work. If your baby is having decelerations that are ominous, and yet we delay a c/s (as many of these articles, and other anti-c/s advocates) because we are "relying" on a machine, sure, things might turn out just fine. But what if they don't? Yup, you'll sue us. I, the nurse, the doctor, and all involved are going to get dragged into court. Do you know that the hospital has QI initiatives to improve the "call to cut" time for c-sections? That means we need to get patients to the OR FASTER becase of bad outcomes.

 

Also, in response to the article about preterm infants and higher c-section rates, consider this.... in the US, women have way more comorbidities than in any other country. We deliver women who weigh 500lbs, are diabetic, have cardiac issues, have major health issues- in another country these women would either not become pregnant, wouldn't keep their pregnancy, or would die before they got the chance to go into labor! lol We have advanced medicine to such a point that NOTHING is natural anymore. Natural selection would weed these patients out- they simply wouldn't survive pregnancy, much less have the opportunity to become a statistic. This is also why we have so many more complications in this country- the obesity alone is a HUGE contributor.

 

Another thought: Do you have any idea how many elective inductions we do? Many of these result in a c-section. These are inductions purely for the patient's convenience. Not because the doctors are making them- these women WANT to be delivered, regardless of the method. Ask poor Christine, who can't sleep, can't eat, can't do anything right now she's so uncomfortable. I bet, given the option, that she'd have to resist hard not to pick an induction or c-section right now rather than wait almost another month. We'll labor people for DAYS before we finally have to do a c-section.

 

Have you seen "The Business of Being Born"? It's a documentary by Ricki Lake. You'd probably like it- it's definitely anti c/s. But, it's full of so many contradictory statements, and misinformation it's maddening. However, to the lay person, it's taken as gospel truth. How many babies have CP and other disorders related to oxygen deprivation related to deliveries where intervention was denied? I could tell you absolute HORROR stories of things that have happened at our local "Birth Center" run by midwives. Yes, I could tell you horror stories of things that happened in the hospital too- but those are things that happened despite our ability to intervene. Bad things happen in a birth center because people are too ignorant to know what intervention is needed.

 

Yes, women have been having babies for thousands of years. And it is a natural process. But, if you knew something could save your life, or save your baby's life, wouldn't you want that option? The last 2 infant codes I've been in on have been midwife deliveries, btw...deliveries without fetal monitoring, without much intervention, etc.

 

Sorry if I sound harsh, but there is soooo much ignorance on this topic. It is a huge problem. But, it's not just the medical system's problem. It starts with the patient, and the choices that patients make.

[Birdie07]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sarah OK, I could write a short novel here... as a Labor & Delivery nurse, I too am alarmed at the rising number of c-sections. But, I can tell you that there is sooooooo much more to the story than is evident in these articles. They are definitely written in an anti-c/s point of view. The rising percentage of c/s in the US is a result of many factors, and I will be the first to agree that physician convenience is occasionally a contributor. However, this is LARGELY the exception, not the rule. In my 3 years as a L&D nurse, I can think of THREE c/s that I attended and thought they were for a BS reason. Regardless of whether it is right or not, fear of litigation is a ruling factor in ALL American medicine, and obstetrics holds the highest rate of litigation- for obvious reasons. Here's the thing (and probably a novel concept for non-medical personnell): PATIENTS are to blame for this, NOT the medical professionals. Doctors and nurses are only responding to the enviroment in which we've been forced to work. If your baby is having decelerations that are ominous, and yet we delay a c/s (as many of these articles, and other anti-c/s advocates) because we are "relying" on a machine, sure, things might turn out just fine. But what if they don't? Yup, you'll sue us. I, the nurse, the doctor, and all involved are going to get dragged into court. Do you know that the hospital has QI initiatives to improve the "call to cut" time for c-sections? That means we need to get patients to the OR FASTER becase of bad outcomes. Also, in response to the article about preterm infants and higher c-section rates, consider this.... in the US, women have way more comorbidities than in any other country. We deliver women who weigh 500lbs, are diabetic, have cardiac issues, have major health issues- in another country these women would either not become pregnant, wouldn't keep their pregnancy, or would die before they got the chance to go into labor! lol We have advanced medicine to such a point that NOTHING is natural anymore. Natural selection would weed these patients out- they simply wouldn't survive pregnancy, much less have the opportunity to become a statistic. This is also why we have so many more complications in this country- the obesity alone is a HUGE contributor. Another thought: Do you have any idea how many elective inductions we do? Many of these result in a c-section. These are inductions purely for the patient's convenience. Not because the doctors are making them- these women WANT to be delivered, regardless of the method. Ask poor Christine, who can't sleep, can't eat, can't do anything right now she's so uncomfortable. I bet, given the option, that she'd have to resist hard not to pick an induction or c-section right now rather than wait almost another month. We'll labor people for DAYS before we finally have to do a c-section. Have you seen "The Business of Being Born"? It's a documentary by Ricki Lake. You'd probably like it- it's definitely anti c/s. But, it's full of so many contradictory statements, and misinformation it's maddening. However, to the lay person, it's taken as gospel truth. How many babies have CP and other disorders related to oxygen deprivation related to deliveries where intervention was denied? I could tell you absolute HORROR stories of things that have happened at our local "Birth Center" run by midwives. Yes, I could tell you horror stories of things that happened in the hospital too- but those are things that happened despite our ability to intervene. Bad things happen in a birth center because people are too ignorant to know what intervention is needed. Yes, women have been having babies for thousands of years. And it is a natural process. But, if you knew something could save your life, or save your baby's life, wouldn't you want that option? The last 2 infant codes I've been in on have been midwife deliveries, btw...deliveries without fetal monitoring, without much intervention, etc. Sorry if I sound harsh, but there is soooo much ignorance on this topic. It is a huge problem. But, it's not just the medical system's problem. It starts with the patient, and the choices that patients make.

I think we might have to agree to disagree. Yes I have seen TBOBB. I actually liked that movie. I took my DH and another couple along with us. While you make good points on c-sections needed in a emergency, alot of c-sections are being done b/c women just want to be done. Or a doctor doesn't want to sit around and wait for a woman to go at her own pace. I don't know how many times I've heard women go in and the doctor says start pitocin which makes your contractions harder and then the pain is so much she gets an epidural and then it slows it down and the doc says it's not happening fast enough lets do a c-section. I totally agree c-sections are a need at times when it's medically necessary! But this lets go in get a c-section so we can all go home is unnecessary. It gives too many risks. And then you have to find a doctor next time around who will do VBACS which is hard to do also. If we didn't have all these Doctors scaring women about childbirth, women might want to do it natural with out all these medical interventions. Yes they are needed in some cases but not as many that are happening today.

[JHarwood2Be]

I have been a L&D nurse for only a short while (1 and 1/2 year). But I also have to agree with a lot of what Sarah has said. Our primary c-sections are either for life-saving measures or a failed induction because the body was not ready to labor. Other reasons would be untreated herpes, breech or transverse presentation, not just because a patient wants one. We also give our patients a lot of time to change their cervix. We do run into the time crunch when water has been broken for over 18 hours with no signs of imminent delivery. Moms and babies can get very sick. I think our docs give a very fair trial of labor, for even the slightest change is great if mom and baby are tolerating it.

We also make sure to not admit someone if they are not in active labor. If they are uncomfortable, we will treat with pain meds if desired.

I'm disappointed to hear that TBOBB was biased and mis informative. I will probably still see it.

[LadyCheese]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaliaA07 I have tried to tell my sisters but when I told them they didn't talk to me for weeks. My mother had 7 kids and thinks all her girls have no trouble. I tried to tell her once and everything I said she had an answer for so I felt let down. I don't want to try again with her.

Thx Calia...(IMO) I must agree that c-sect should be done only if medically needed, not out of convenience for the mother or the doctor (like my Dr who was exhausted and talking about going home).

Calia, I'm so sorry to hear you are having difficulties in TTC.

[Christine]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaliaA07 I think we might have to agree to disagree. Yes I have seen TBOBB. I actually liked that movie. I took my DH and another couple along with us. While you make good points on c-sections needed in a emergency, alot of c-sections are being done b/c women just want to be done. Or a doctor doesn't want to sit around and wait for a woman to go at her own pace. I don't know how many times I've heard women go in and the doctor says start pitocin which makes your contractions harder and then the pain is so much she gets an epidural and then it slows it down and the doc says it's not happening fast enough lets do a c-section. I totally agree c-sections are a need at times when it's medically necessary! But this lets go in get a c-section so we can all go home is unnecessary. It gives too many risks. And then you have to find a doctor next time around who will do VBACS which is hard to do also. If we didn't have all these Doctors scaring women about childbirth, women might want to do it natural with out all these medical interventions. Yes they are needed in some cases but not as many that are happening today.

I actually asked my Dr. about the epidural slowing things down and she said there is really no truth to that, every woman's body reacts differently.
And if a woman chooses to have an elective c-section its her body and her choice I don't really think those should count in this discussion.
I had a friend who just had a scheduled c-section because as a petite woman it was discovered that at 41 weeks she was not dialating AT ALL and her baby was almost 10lbs, for the safety of the baby they didn't even bother inducing her instead just scheduled a c-section. She was a big pro-natural birth advocate and didn't even want any drugs, however when faced with the prospect of being pregnant any longer or putting her baby at risk because after 40 weeks your placenta does not work properly anymore, she chose the c-section.
I really don't know what Dr's are not informing their patients about the risks, however I also believe its a patients responsibility to ask questions and do what is best for them, I mean honestly its your life and your child's life.

[Alyssa]

great topic girls! I love the respectful debating

 

i see both sides of this - for me personally i do not believe in non-medically necessary C-sections but that is only what is right for me.

 

i don't judge anyone else's decisions - it is all about information and education.

 

i have friends who have done the scheduled c-section for convenience and would still do the same thing - i also have friends who have birthed by candle light with a douhla.

 

i am in the process of switching from an OBGYN to a Midwife to that when FI and I start TTC we are already in a good relationship with a Midwife - we plan to do everything as naturally as possible but accept that if there is a medical need, we will be in network at the best hospital in our city.

[starchild]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alyssa i am in the process of switching from an OBGYN to a Midwife to that when FI and I start TTC we are already in a good relationship with a Midwife - we plan to do everything as naturally as possible but accept that if there is a medical need, we will be in network at the best hospital in our city.

I love the idea of a midwife and would totally like to do it as natural as possible. Generally I would trust a grandma who has delivered 50 babies over many doctors, but I'm kind of deterred by Sarah's experiences. I know she didn't share to scare or deter anyone, but if that's what she sees as a L&D nurse...I wonder if the midwives in her cases were just ignorant or if it's dangerous in general?

I need to do my own research on this. Alyssa maybe you and I will be the BDW midwife test cases..lol

[Alyssa]

Quote:

Originally Posted by starchild I love the idea of a midwife and would totally like to do it as natural as possible. Generally I would trust a grandma who has delivered 50 babies over many doctors, but I'm kind of deterred by Sarah's experiences. I know she didn't share to scare or deter anyone, but if that's what she sees as a L&D nurse...I wonder if the midwives in her cases were just ignorant or if it's dangerous in general? I need to do my own research on this. Alyssa maybe you and I will be the BDW midwife test cases..lol

Jamy,
I have actually had extensive conversations with Sarah about Midwives and she is very much PRO midwife, her concerns are around 'the right midwives' and dealing with a group that is integrated into a hospital (in case things happen).

(Sarah - sorry for speaking for you! I will leave room for you to interject)

So, I am going with an OBGYN group that has a bunch of Dr.'s, NPT and midwives that all work together. I don't like to chew gum b/c it has artificial shit in it, i never take tylenol or advil for pain, eat organic, etc. i can not imagine getting meds unless of an extreme emergency. i also have a high tolerance for pain and would expect childbirth to hurt like hell but feel like we will do our best to prepare to mentally accept the pain and just deal with it. does that make sense?